Title: On conscious business with Anabel Dumlao

Guest: Anabel Dumlao, Partner at Axialent

Episode overview:
What does it take to lead with consciousness and inclusion? In this episode, I sit down with Anabel Dumlao, an expert in conscious business, cultural transformation, and leadership development, to explore how leaders can build authentic and inclusive workplaces.

We also dive into the Filipino concept of kapwa, or shared identity and interconnectedness, and how it influences leadership and belonging in organizations.

Key topics & takeaways:

• What conscious business really means and why it’s crucial for leadership
• The biggest barriers to creating cultures of belonging in organizations
• How to move beyond performative allyship and embed real inclusion in leadership
• Why vulnerability is essential in fostering inclusive teams
• How Kapwa plays a role in leadership and cultural transformation
• Practical steps leaders can take today to create a more inclusive environment

Memorable quotes:

“You can’t work on promoting conscious business while being an unconscious human.” – Anabel Dumlao
“What you do speaks so loudly that I cannot hear what you say.” – Ralph Waldo Emerson (shared by Anabel)
“When you accept that you don’t have all the answers and that’s okay, then you open up to listen and you really listen to understand.” – Chared Verschuur

Resources & links:

🔗 Connect with Anabel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anabeldumlao/
🔗 Learn more about Axialent: https://www.axialent.com/
🎧 Listen now: https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-dvuqk-181bfd6

If you enjoyed this episode, don’t forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share it with someone who cares about creating a more inclusive future!

[00:00:00] Chared Verschuur: Hello, and welcome to the Good Comms podcast, the podcast where we explore the power of inclusive leadership and communication and shine a light on individuals who are committed to creating a sense of belonging and building a better, more equitable world. I’m your host, Chared Verschuur, inclusive leadership and communication consultant, and I’m thrilled to welcome Annabelle Dumlau, partner at Axialent, known for her expertise in conscious business, cultural transformation, and leadership development.

[00:00:51] Together, we’ll discuss how leaders can inspire authenticity, create belonging, and lead inclusively. We’ll also explore the Filipino concept of kapwa, a unique perspective on shared identity and interconnectedness, and its relevance to leadership and belonging. Annabelle, welcome to the podcast.

[00:01:11] Anabel Dumlao: Thank you so much for having me here.

[00:01:14] Chared Verschuur: Can you tell us more about yourself?

[00:01:16] Anabel Dumlao: I was born and raised in Manila, Philippines, by a Filipino father and a Spanish mother. My birth language was Spanish. We moved permanently to Spain in 1986 with people power and all that. I pursued higher education to study law, business administration and economics. That paved the way to me landing quite quickly a job in a consulting firm as management skills training consultant. I started at Ernst Young. And there met one of the current partners of Axialent. So Axialent was in the making for 20 plus years.

[00:01:58] I started there developing management training courses and evolved to the neighboring practices in HR, broadening the HR consulting spectrum. I moved because of an acquisition. EY’s consulting arm was acquired by a firm whose main business was technology. I was not into HR technology. I was for the people side of things. I was fortunate enough to encounter Hewitt Associates. They were all and only about HR. I learned so much. Now another merger came along and we were acquired this time by an insurance broker. Totally different model. The business itself was different from where I saw myself thriving. And I jumped ship again. Because of culture. And because I felt I didn’t belong.

[00:02:49] Chared Verschuur: Where did you see yourself thriving?

[00:02:51] Anabel Dumlao: In the people side. From the get go, I was about people, and that carried me throughout my entire career, everything I enjoy, where I thrive and where I provided value was in connection with people. So a manager when I was a trainee at EY was at Axialent already and he kept asking so how are you, and I’m working at a place where I believe you will belong, you’re gonna love this type of work. I really am very thankful that he insisted. He was aggressively recruiting me to Axialent and I was the one holding back. I was skeptical. It just sounded too good to be true, but we found a way. I’m there since eight years already.

[00:03:32] Chared Verschuur: So how does Axialent’s approach to leadership and cultural transformation align with your personal values?

[00:03:38] Anabel Dumlao: Axialent is about conscious business. We’re on a mission to raise consciousness in the world of business in particular. AXIA comes from Greek and it means values. It means value in economical sense of the word and also in moral sense of the world. The ethical part of values. And then, LENT is borrowed from the word ‘excellent’. The greatest standard of life as a person as a collective and as a business. So for me, the name itself is a great summary of how Axialent it really is. A cry of hope that the world of work, that doing business can be good and is a force for good.

[00:04:20] Chared Verschuur: What excites you most about your work in fostering conscious businesses?

[00:04:25] Anabel Dumlao: It’s that it’s not a perpetual honeymoon. This is not an easy job. It’s beautiful, it’s inspiring, it’s motivating, but it’s not easy. The inspiration is that it’s real and it’s embracing your humanity, flaws and all, and still find joy and pursue purpose. So for me, it’s like grounded idealism.

[00:04:45] Chared Verschuur: Can we say that what excites you is that it remains challenging?

[00:04:48] Anabel Dumlao: It requires me to actually keep doing the work for myself so I can be of service to others. You can’t work promoting conscious business by being an unconscious human. So it keeps me on my toes and doing the work . Doesn’t mean that I don’t fall into those pockets of unconscious like behavior. By that I mean going on autopilot. Where you know, like I just react instead of choose my response. So when I get reactive, for instance, Hey, I’m human. But now I have the tools to catch myself and say, ” so now how do I become a little wiser?” And help others along the way.  

[00:05:24] Chared Verschuur: How would you define inclusive leadership?

[00:05:27] Anabel Dumlao: For me, inclusive leadership are the mindsets and behaviors that allow companies, organizations, groups, that share a common purpose to actually make people feel in their bones that they belong there. It is a set of mindsets, because without the proper mindsets, you don’t behave inclusively. And set of behaviors that when leaders demonstrate those behaviors or display those behaviors, people observe those behaviors and understand the message that “you belong here. You are wanted here. This is a space for you to thrive, to be your best self.”

[00:06:04] Chared Verschuur: From your experience, what are the biggest challenges leaders face in creating cultures of belonging?

[00:06:10] Anabel Dumlao: It’s the stories in our heads that keeps saying over and over. I am totally equitable. We’re running a fair company here. That’s the main source that I’ve discovered is getting in the way of so many. I’m already fair. I’m a good person. I’m a grown up leader. I am not discriminating. I’m super inclusive. And given that story and I believe that, I will never ever critically examine my decisions or question, am I being biased in this particular instance? Because I’m great. See how that can get in the way of you all of a sudden deciding or weighing into a decision about hiring someone without realizing that position is biased, that your recommendation is biased, that slips through the cracks and all of a sudden you’re not contributing to a culture of inclusiveness and belonging.  

[00:07:06] Chared Verschuur: So you’re saying that it’s our being convinced that we are good people that’s actually keeping us from doing the work.

[00:07:15] Anabel Dumlao: If you’re already done, it’s out of your mind. It’s about awareness. The key there is to distinguish and catch yourself.

[00:07:22] Chared Verschuur: Does vulnerability also play a part in your work then?

[00:07:26] Anabel Dumlao: Big part because that humility that you need to be curious, to seek understanding and letting go of the need to be right is super vulnerable. Being vulnerable is the bravest thing you can do. If we want to progress into a more inclusive workplace or world in general, we cannot assume that we’re going to get this right all the time. We’re going to slip back. We’re going to make mistakes. We’re going to say the wrong thing. We’re going to offend people. We need to come to terms with that. That it needs to get messy. And that’s just part of our human nature. So let’s just embrace our humanity and do a better job next time. Vulnerability is an important part of the equation. And again, I think there’s a misconception of vulnerability, oversharing and all that, and it takes consciousness to know what belongs to private life and what is conscious vulnerability, meaning we’re not perfect. Perfection does not exist. Let’s come to terms with that. The intention with which you are sharing is very important and making your intention explicit helps the other understand what to do with that. In the end, it’s your choice. Confidentiality, holding a safe space, is also so important in inclusive cultures. 

[00:08:45] Chared Verschuur: We’re going into shared identity and interconnectedness. And in the Philippines there’s this concept of kapwa. Can you tell us more about how you see it influencing your work as a leader in inclusive spaces and conscious businesses?

[00:08:59] Anabel Dumlao: I love the term. It gave me a word to explain something so complex. One of my firm beliefs is that we are all connected with each other and to something greater than all of us together. That is the beautiful word kapwa. In hindsight as I was growing up and how I’m observing the Filipino workplace as I’m going back home to do more consulting work for Axialent, that’s there. You can feel it. It’s in our bones that we feel interconnected to each other. And at the same time, I experience our behaviors as pretty divisive sometimes how ironic. So it’s like this inner struggle that’s ingrained. We believe in kapwa and at the same time, I’m curious about what led us to behave in a classist society, in a hierarchical work situation. How do they co inhabit the same space? Like how does that work in unison? Could it also be similar to my torn identity? That’s my take on kapwa.

[00:10:04] Chared Verschuur: It’s interesting how you describe that, like it’s yin and yang. Being hierarchical and also believing that you’re interconnected with someone. Because if we were living to that value in the Philippines, there wouldn’t be corruption.

[00:10:16] Anabel Dumlao: Do they believe it as what I believe? Maybe they don’t. Maybe there are other ways to see it. But the thing is that I found a word to express what I believe is there. And that is causing a lot of, I don’t know, pain or frustration or friction. Because if that’s the underlying belief, and the leadership behaviors are different, that takes a toll. So what culture do you want? One that is in sync with the underlying values of a whole people? Those two layers of how we behave and what we truly value, I think there’s an opportunity there to get them closer together.

[00:10:52] Chared Verschuur: Can you share with us a case or success story that stands out as a powerful example of transformation and why that worked?

[00:11:02] Anabel Dumlao: I’d get a little more personal and share my own personal transformation. I basically grew up developing the muscle of wanting to fill the room because of what I lacked in size. And as a consultant, I had knowledge and skills so everything had the ingredients of reinforcing that, “hey, you have to be really knowledgeable”. I thought that if I didn’t show up knowledgeable, they wouldn’t hire me, my bosses wouldn’t promote me, I would not be staffed in the most interesting projects. So I developed a muscle of, “you have to know, you have to know a lot”, and then that came to the extreme of, ” you have to be the best”. And that little story influences your mindset and how you show up. And I showed up like that for a great part of my career. Sometimes it was good and sometimes it backfired. I went to the extreme opposite. It’s ” let’s be super humble “. I just shut up. Like all these stories that I replaced those other stories with and weren’t working either. None of the extremes were working. Using the tools of introspection, of learning getting feedback, making that feedback work for me. Truly believing it’s a present and not a dart. Being friends with my being an expert and holding my expertise lightly enough to be open to new perspectives. That’s my biggest transformation.

[00:12:30] Chared Verschuur: And isn’t that an example of inclusive leadership as well?

[00:12:34] Anabel Dumlao: It helps a lot because once you don’t have to have all the answers, you open up that people bring the answers from their perspectives. And it’s so much richer. I’ve seen things I did not see before? It’s natural. You’re only seeing your side of things and everybody else has multiple, like they’re looking from different points of view, it’s so much more comprehensive. It’s much more powerful when you have the collective insights.

[00:13:02] Chared Verschuur: That’s really wise because when you accept that you don’t have all the answers and that’s okay, then you open up to listen and then you really listen to understand. Why is the role of the leader in creating cultures of belonging or inclusion important?

[00:13:19] Anabel Dumlao: Because no matter what you do or what you say, everybody is looking at you to emulate what you’re doing. Your example is crucial, a very important source of the messages that people receive of what they have to be. So being very intentional about what you do speaks very loudly. There’s a beautiful quote of Ralph Waldo Emerson, ” what you do speak so loudly that I cannot hear what you say”. So it’s crucial that what you display as behaviors are inclusive behaviors, because that’s what people are going to be emulating.

[00:13:53] Chared Verschuur: If there are current leaders right now who would like to create inclusive teams, inclusive cultures, and a sense of belonging what is one impactful action that they can take?  

[00:14:05] Anabel Dumlao: It starts from within. Check your intentions. Start with you. Start with ” How am I feeling about this whole thing? Why do I want an inclusive culture?” Take this luxury of being really honest with yourself and answer those questions earnestly. “What do I want to achieve? Why do I want this?” And find the most noble reason that will make you really want to go and actually do something. So for me, the first step is check your intention and what you want to achieve.

[00:14:36] Chared Verschuur: Thank you. Is there anything else you want to share with us?

[00:14:39] Anabel Dumlao: Let’s replicate these types of conversations. Let’s talk about it in a non adversarial way. That brings up our multiple truths. There’s no one truth. That’s another thing. So let’s exchange our views take it one step at a time.

[00:14:54] Chared Verschuur: And if they want to meet Anabel, where can they contact you? 

[00:14:58] Anabel Dumlao: Anabel Dumlao is on LinkedIn so please feel free to reach out, connect, and if you like what you read or what I post, DM me. And if you’re in the Philippines, I’ll be there more often. I’m on a mission to raise the level of leadership to be more conscious leaders and build more constructive and inclusive cultures. So let me know I can drop by.

[00:15:20] Chared Verschuur: Thank you, Anabel, for that lovely conversation. In the upcoming episodes, you can expect a mix of solo and interview episodes where you will meet leaders, change makers, and experts who are already practicing inclusive leadership, creating a sense of belonging and championing positive social impact. If you are one of them, please reach out. We’d love to hear your voice here.

[00:15:44] Thank you for joining me on this episode of the Good Comms podcast. If you find it helpful, please subscribe, leave a review, or share it with someone who cares about creating a more inclusive future. If it sparked your curiosity about the work I do, I’d love for you to connect with me on LinkedIn or visit my website at goodcomms.nl for more information.

[00:16:05] You may also send me a message through chared@goodcomms.nl. Let’s continue the conversation and keep building thriving cultures and impactful futures together. Until next time, remember, inclusive leadership can be learned, and it starts with you. This is Chared Verschuur, podcasting for Good Comms.